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If you have not downloaded a free copy of Bobby Rio's 'Small Talk Tactics', you can grab it here:

Small Talk Tactics Report Download Page

I asked a variety of questions to Bobby on conversations escalation, see below.


Leo T


Why did you decide to put out a course on "small talk?"


Because it wasn't until I mastered "small talk" that I began to have sort of consistent success with women.

And the funny thing is… almost no one tells you this.  In fact, they tell you just the opposite, they say "avoid small talk"

Well, I went around for years avoiding small talk- and my conversations went nowhere. 

I'm a naturally "introverted" guy.  And the main reason that I struggled so long was because I didn't understand the basic principles behind having an engaging conversation.

And a HUGE realization I had was that in order to "inject" all of these attraction building techniques into a conversation – YOU NEED TO BE ABLE TO KEEP A CONVERSAITON GOING.

Now, this course isn't on "small talk" the way you are used to thinking about it.  The course shows you how to take normal, mundane "small talk" and turn it into a "sexy" conversation.

What is exactly is "sexy small talk"?

I refer to "sexy small talk" as conversation that is fun, playful, and flirtatious. 
For a long time I only had two modes; either I was in boring "interview" mode or I was in deep rapport talking about serious topics. 

What I realized is that most real attraction takes place during the light, playful, back and forth banter that takes place early in a conversation.  

Once you really begin to understand this; a whole new world opens up. 

I used to think that I had to talk to a girl for awhile and have this incredibly intense conversation to get her attracted to me… but that's just not the case.
In fact, a lot of times having an intense conversation with a woman creates too much rapport- and it's impossible to pull back and shift gears into a more sexual realm.

What's great about "sexy small talk" is that you can whip it out anywhere.  Whether you're in class talking with a classmate, at your job, in the bank, or a grocery store… you're just ALWAYS ON - and you're the guy that women want to talk to…

This doesn't mean you're going to get 100% of the girls you're talking too.  But it does mean that no matter who you're talking to your both going to enjoy the conversation.

It beats the hell out of that boring, 'try hard', conversation that most of us have suffered through at some point.

How can a guy become "more funny" while talking to a woman?

It was only recently I came to realize that making women laugh was COMPLETELY different than I had previously thought.

For the longest time I used to believe that that the same humor that had my friends rolling on the floor in laughter would naturally cause the same reaction in the women I was talking to.

Wouldn’t it make sense?  Isn’t comedy supposed to be universal?

But when I really started to pay attention to what women were laughing at I started to notice:

  1. The sarcastic wit that made me a hit around most of my guy friends very seldom got positive reactions around women.
  2. Some of the guys I knew who had the lamest, most childish humor, often seemed to get the best reaction of women.
  3. Women very rarely judged the originality and cleverness of humor the way my guy friends did.

It was right then that I came to realize that women don’t want funny.

They want fun.

I had always concentrated so hard on finding those perfect one-liners that would pronounce me the king of comedy and have my audience amazed at my originality and wit…. That I forgot who my audience was…

Women aren’t that funny.

Women don’t really care about original, witty, and sharp humor.

Women want to have fun.

They don’t want to have to think.  And if your jokes are making them think too much, you’re probably taking them out of the moment.

If you’re a guy having trouble making women laugh, then your first step is to look around and pay attention to what they are actually laughing at.

  1. You’ll see that they much rather watch silly romantic comedies than the witty indie dark comedies that win all the awards.
  2. You’ll see that they don’t care much about the originality of your jokes… and in fact they are more likely to laugh at you repeating a knock knock joke you heard in the sixth grade than whatever sarcastic remark that pops into your mind.
  3. You’ll see that women don’t appreciate the concept of “cool” the way men do.  Women would rather you take the stick out of your ass and act in a fun silly way than stand around like you’re a big shot.
  4. Playground humor never gets old. Never.

Women want you be around a guy that allows them to have fun.  The next time that you are out with a woman and engaged in a conversation with her, make it a priority to take the conversation back to the playground.

How can a guy calm his nervousness while talking to a woman?

The quickest and most reliable way to calm nervousness is to develop an intention.

Fear, nervousness, and anxiety stem from not knowing what to do.

You see, once you know what your next move is you have no time to worry about it. 

You just do it.

The problem is most guys have no clue what they are supposed to be doing.  And even worse, they have no clue what the ultimate result is they are after.

When you start talking to a woman… what is your intention?  Do you want to get her phone number?  Do you want to get a date?  Do you want to try to have sex with her that night? 

Most guys don't know.

And because of this you get into a conversation with a girl- and you're continually looking for a reason to eject.  In fact, when she says "I have to go to the bathroom" you're probably happy because it takes all of the pressure off of you.

That’s because you weren't committed to any real outcome. 

I remember when I first graduated college.  I was really unsure of what I wanted to do with my life. So I tried a lot of careers.  And very soon into these different careers I would get really nervous about my future.  I would start to think I was never going to make it.  And at the first sign of an obstacle I would give up.

I got nervous and gave up easily because there was no intention behind what I was doing.  I was not committed to making it in any of these careers.

Later, when I started TSB Magazine… I was just as broke, just as clueless… but I knew what I wanted.  I wanted to create a magazine that would help millions of men.  So I no longer worried about my future.  I no longer worried when I came up against an obstacle.  I just kept figuring out what I had to do next to get to the outcome I was after.

So once you figure out what outcome you want with a girl… just keep focused on what you need to do next?  And don't stop until you get that outcome.

Does that make sense?

Are there any specific techniques that have really made an improvement in your conversation skills over the years?

Yes.  It's called "Hit the Fast Forward Button"

For me, my biggest frustration was always the first few minutes of a conversation.  It always felt awkward and "forced."  And I would constantly find myself wondering "does she even want to be talking to me?"

And because of this, I tended to stay on "safe" and "boring" topics.  And ultimately most of my conversations would die out really quickly. 

This even happened with girls I knew already.  For instance, I would be out at a bar and see a girl from one of my classes, and SHE WOULD APPROACH ME…  yet, I still couldn't advance the conversation beyond "how have you been?  So what have you been up to? Blah blah blah."

I shudder just thinking about how many girls I lost because I let the conversation sputter out way too soon.

It finally got to the point where I HATED even talking to a girl… because I knew how boring it would be.

Well, one night I was out at a bar with a friend.  The next morning I was booked to go sky diving and was literally shitting myself with visions of the parachute not opening…

Now, in the middle of this conversation two girls stand next to us and order drinks from the bar.  And my friend starts a conversation with one of them. 

With my mind preoccupied on skydiving I was in no mood to go through the motions of "get to know you" chit chat.  So I simply said "I don't mean to be rude… but I'm shitting a brick right now.  Tomorrow morning I'm scheduled to jump out of plane from a couple thousand feet in the air… And I need you to convince me that the parachute is going to open…"

Well, I thought the girls would find it rude that I just completely bypassed the "get to know you" stuff… but they seem relieved.  They were completely engaged in talking about skydiving… and we went on to have a really fun, playful conversation.

And that is when I realized you can "hit the fast forward button."

I went on to test this technique hundreds of times.  Really early into a conversation I would just jump to a topic that is more conducive to building rapport and attraction.  And what I found is that girls actually seemed happy to skip the small talk too.

What are some of the major mistakes guys make in their conversations?

It's funny…because when you finally figure this out- you'll look back and see that there were just a handful of tweaks you needed to make… and these tweaks vary from guy to guy.

Some guys spend too much time trying to appear "cool" to a woman- and wind up coming across as stiff and boring.  For these guys, they need to learn how to inject some fun and playfulness into their conversations.

Some guys tend to get stuck at a "friendly" level.  These guys need to learn how to spot when there is "too much" rapport happening.  Attraction is a balancing act between "tension" and "comfort."  And a lot of the guys who get stuck at a friendly level are so afraid of the "tension" that they spend way too much time building rapport thinking it will make the woman like them.  - And it will… as a FRIEND.

Some guys have no clue what to say to a woman.  These guys need to learn how to spot the hooks a woman is giving him.  Every time a woman opens her mouth and says something it should be triggering three or four things you can say back.  The problem a lot of these guys face (and I suffered this for YEARS) is that they spend too much time in their own head trying to think of what to say next.  A woman will give you all the material you need.  You've just got to learn to spot it.

But the biggest mistake most men are making is that there conversation are one dimensional and flat.   This is because they don't have enough "weapons" in their arsenal. 

Maybe they are comfortable at telling stories… so that's all they do.  Or maybe they spend the entire time asking questions.  Or maybe they are funny – so they rely too much on humor.

The fact is, you need to always have about five techniques you "whip out" to keep the conversation flowing and EXCITING.  A conversation should be like a rollercoaster- where the woman doesn't know what twist and turn will come next.

How can a guy avoid awkward silences and "running out of things to say?"

Ah… my biggest fear. 

For me, I was more afraid of the awkwardness of having nothing left to say- than I ever was of rejection.  In fact, if a woman openly rejected me- I could take it.  What I couldn’t take was standing there not knowing if I should keep talking to her, or give up.  I hated thinking the woman was just being polite and really wished I would leave.

But here is thing…

The easiest way to completely eliminate awkwardness is to acknowledge it in a humorous way. 

By calling out the "elephant in the room" and saying what you're both thinking… it demonstrates that you are socially intelligent.  And social intelligence is EXTREMELY attractive to a woman.

It's sort of like if you've ever had a girl turn her cheek when you went for the kiss.  The worse thing to do is pretend it didn't happen.  Because the both of you know you tried to kiss her- so you're not fooling anyone by acting "cool" about it.

Just say (in a mocking 'announcer type' voice) "And she slips him the cheek". This sort of humorous response will put you both back at ease.
Women fear awkwardness even more than men do… so by showing a woman you have enough social intelligence not to let things get awkward… you become a lot more attractive in her eyes.

What are the best topics to talk about with a woman?

Great question. 

The number one fear that holds most men back from approaching a woman they are interested in is the fear of awkward silences and running out of things to say…  And if you can inject your consciousness with a steady stream of topics… you'll be much more "quick witted" and this fear will eventually disappear… and you'll naturally find yourself talking to women wherever you are.

But not all topics are created equal.

And most will just bore her silly. 

She doesn’t want to hear about your job.  She doesn't care about how long you've lived in your current city.  And if one more guy asks her "Do you come hear often?" she will probably scream.

So what are some traits of topics that she DOES want to talk about.  And more importantly… what are the traits of topics that will lead you to your desired outcome… ATTRACTION.

There are six main traits that good topics possess:

  1. A good topic should build rapport. 
  2. A good topic should create an emotional state
  3. A good topic should make you three dimensional.  
  4. A good topic provides hooks to keep a conversation going. 
  5. A good topic allows you to display your attractive qualities.  
  6. A good topic leads to sexuality

So based on the six criteria listed above I've uncovered 12 "almost magical" topics that will lead you towards your objective of creating attraction. 

They KEY is to have a handful of topics so that you don't run the risk of dwelling on anyone of them too long.

Now, I don't have time to into all 12… but I'm going to give you a few.
One of the best topics of conversation with women is early years and childhood

We very rarely get a chance to talk about it.  When we do- it opens up a flood gate of emotions. 

If something stands out vividly in your mind years after it happened it will probably be interesting to the person you're talking to. For instance, I went to a nightmare of a sleep-a-way camp when I was young… and can still capture the attention of a room recounting the horrors of that experience.

You also want to ask her questions that will get her recounting her childhood experiences.

Not only does talking about our childhood bring out emotions many of us haven't felt in awhile… it also is a refreshing change of pace from our current reality. Plus it lends itself to humor, a sense of rapport, and with some skill can easily be transitioned into something on a more sexual level.

Another great topic for conversation is Travel.

People love to talk about travel. 

They key here is to let her talk. Don't feel the need to jump in immediately and tell your stories or brag about where you've been.  Instead use it as an opportunity to dig deeper into her interests, desires, and passions, and world views.

And have a couple your own "travel stories" ready.  Instead of just giving a laundry list of places you've been to… have one or two memorable stories from one of your recent adventures. (The more exotic the location the better)

Travel is an attraction trigger.  Women are naturally attracted to men who travel a lot.  It makes them seem worldly and slightly out of reach.

Once you know what sort of topics make for best conversations with women… it is time to start introducing them into your conversations.

The best way to do this is through a technique I call "rooting."

"Rooting" means you say something that plants the seed of what you are about to say next."

For instance, if you want to begin talking about "early childhood memories" you could say something like:

"You totally have this way about you that reminds me of my third grade teacher Mrs. Robbins.  Haha… I remember one time in that class…"

See how you easily began talking about "early childhood memories" by simply rooting it by telling her she reminds you of your third grade teacher.

What is something guys will be surprised to learn in Conversation Escalation: Make Small Talk Sexy?

I think that guys are going to be surprised to learn how many techniques and tools are available to make a conversation more interesting and engaging-  and I think they are going to kick themselves of for not using them sooner.

For me, the biggest surprise as I began to uncover a lot of these tools was how simple they are too implement.

For instance, in this program we are going to show you how to "steer" a conversation along.   How to spot the "hooks" a woman is giving you.  You'll learn how to "bait" a woman into asking you about things you want to be talking about.

You're also going to learn how inject "sexuality" into a conversation.  Because ultimately- you can have an hour long amazing conversation with a woman- but if you don't get her thinking about you in a "sexual" way- it will be impossible to ever kiss her.

Now there are a ton of techniques you're going to learn that almost force you to become a more attractive talker… but more important than the techniques, I'm going to teach you a "specific" practice routine- so that this new way of communicating comes natural to you- and you remember to use the information when it counts- when you're talking to a woman.

If you want to see a sample of some of things you're going to learn read though "Conversation Escalation: Make Small Talk Sexy":

You mentioned that Conversation Escalation:  Make Small Talk Sexy include a special bonus, can you tell us what that is?

In Conversation Escalation: Make Small Talk Sexy we go over A LOT of specific concepts and techniques for teaching you how to create this "sexy" small talk.
And although in the program we give tons of examples… we found that guys want to be like a fly on the wall and listen in live as this sort of conversation is taking place.

So we went into a bar with a hidden mic and recorded an actual conversation- that results in a kiss close- and we let you listen to the entire thing.

Not only that, but afterwards we do a one hour commentary on the conversation.  This allows you get inside Rob's head and you'll know exactly what made him say the things he said.  It's really a quite brilliant way to learn.
It is also lets you see how easy it is to quickly transition through topics and skip the boring shit you don't want to be talking about.

The one thing I want to leave you with is: No matter how intimidated you are by the thought of becoming a "smooth talker"… you really are a lot closer than you think.

Once you make a handful of "tweaks" you'll find that you actually enjoy talking to women- and will begin to see how easy it is to create attraction.

>>Click Here For Conversation Escalation:  Make Small Talk Sexy<<

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